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DanTheMan1970
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Location: Maryland
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Once Saved Always Saved?
i was talking to someone this morning that believes "Once Saved Always Saved" Now i myself believe thats not true
But any thoughts on the subject?
--- "If you expect disappointment, and everything turns out ok you will never be disappointed" :)
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2/26/2008, 8:08 am
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Order ofMelchizedek
Registered: 07-2006
Location: Here I am
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Re: Once Saved Always Saved?
Well, jump right into the heavy stuff, huh?
One view says that those who seem to fall away, backsliders as they're called, never actually slid forward in the first place. They were never saved, and never truly belonged to Christ.
1 John 2:19
They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.
The Parable of the Sower in Mark 4:1-20 is an important parable. Jesus says to His disciples, "If you don't understand this parable, how will you understand any parable?"
It shows us that some are like the seed sown on rocky places, they have no root, are false converts and seem to fall away. They were not true believers, and as such, when trials or persecution come, they quickly leave the faith.
However, the other view is also backed by Scripture. The Bible is full of warnings against falling into sin, guarding against temptation. If it weren't possible to fall away, then why all the warnings, and how could there be temptation? But maybe the temptation is for those who are not yet true believers, I don't know.
Philippians 2:12
Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling,
Hebrews 10:26
If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,
Both of these views lead us to the same place. Those that believe in OSAS, do not hold to the strawman argument commonly brought against them that they think that once you're saved, you can do whatever you want. If you're truly saved, you will obey the Lord.
On the other hand, those who don't hold to OSAS, do not live in constant fear of falling away, as is the common strawman accusation against them. But they are watchful and cautious of the temptations around them, as the Scriptures warn us.
1 Peter 5:8
Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.
So, that makes it about as clear as mud, huh? Very good question, and much deep theology in the study of it.
In the end, I believe there is a divine tension between the two views, we cannot completely deny one view without denying something in the Bible, but either one taken to the extreme is incorrect.
It's one of those things that we won't fully understand this side of heaven, because we're not God.
Deuteronomy 29:29
The secret things belong to the LORD our God, but the things revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may follow all the words of this law.
Isaiah 55:8-9
"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the LORD.
"As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts.
--- Carry me, I'm just a dead man lying on the carpet, can't find a heartbeat,
Make me breathe, I wanna be a new man, tired of the old one, out with the old plan - JoC
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2/26/2008, 11:48 am
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Moriah Cosmos
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Re: Once Saved Always Saved?
"On the other hand, those who don't hold to OSAS, do not live in constant fear of falling away, as is the common strawman accusation against them. But they are watchful and cautious of the temptations around them, as the Scriptures warn us."
I dont' believe in the OSAS but do not live in constant fear. We are all born as an agent of freewill. If someone slides away, it is a choice they make themselves, it doesn't just happen. Just as choosing to be a Christian one can choose to not be a Christian. One doesn't fall away just because they commit one sin, for all have sinned and fall short, but if they choose to stay in sin and turn their back on God and his grace then yes they have chosen to walk a different path and may enter into an unsaved state. But the great thing is that God just like the father in the prodigal son is always waiting and watching for the return of those who have strayed.
--- ~*~Positive Mental Attitude Advocate~*~
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2/26/2008, 3:32 pm
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DanTheMan1970
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Re: Once Saved Always Saved?
All very good information and thank you Moriah for your comments
--- "If you expect disappointment, and everything turns out ok you will never be disappointed" :)
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2/26/2008, 3:53 pm
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Order ofMelchizedek
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Re: Once Saved Always Saved?
Hmm, you can only view the replies to this if you reply to it yourself. What's up with that?
** oh, it seems that I accidentally fixed it somehow...**
Last edited by Order ofMelchizedek, 2/27/2008, 8:59 am
--- Carry me, I'm just a dead man lying on the carpet, can't find a heartbeat,
Make me breathe, I wanna be a new man, tired of the old one, out with the old plan - JoC
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2/27/2008, 8:55 am
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DanTheMan1970
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Re: Once Saved Always Saved?
And order thank you for your info too...
--- "If you expect disappointment, and everything turns out ok you will never be disappointed" :)
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2/27/2008, 9:17 am
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Staybrite
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Location: Washington State
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Re: Once Saved Always Saved?
This has always been one of those issues that is very difficult for me to wrap my head around. I do however believe it is one of those "soft issues". As Mel said there is scripture to support both sides. So that leads me to believe that our belief in on or the other is not important enough to effect our salvation.
There is a great sermon called "True and False" conversion, that you cant watch, listen to, or read at this site.
True/False Conversion
Someone here pointed this very interesting sermon out to me a little while ago but I can't remember who.
--- Peace, that brief period in history when everyone stops to reload.
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2/27/2008, 11:44 am
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Order ofMelchizedek
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Re: Once Saved Always Saved?
I think I'll go listen to that too.....
--- Carry me, I'm just a dead man lying on the carpet, can't find a heartbeat,
Make me breathe, I wanna be a new man, tired of the old one, out with the old plan - JoC
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2/29/2008, 1:05 pm
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Staybrite
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Re: Once Saved Always Saved?
quoting Order ofMelchizedek ...
I think I'll go listen to that too.....
You mean listen again.
--- Peace, that brief period in history when everyone stops to reload.
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2/29/2008, 2:19 pm
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Bookworm88
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Re: Once Saved Always Saved?
I just read a very interesting blog entry about the once-saved-always-saved position.
http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2010/03/why-i-dont-like-once-saved-aways-saved/
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3/29/2010, 7:13 pm
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